Tiger won't start

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Mal
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Tiger won't start

Post by Mal » Sun Nov 23, 2008 1:26 am

Hi everyone. I have recently bought a 66 Tiger with a 289 engine fitted :D . The trouble is I cannot get it to start :( , there has been no spark from the coil. I bought a multi meter and I was only getting 10v to the coil on the possitve side and only about 2v on the neg side.I replaced the coil but it did not fix the problem. I removed the ign switch and the tape that was there (obviously now) to help hold all the wires on,
which promptly all came of their terminals before I had seen where any had come from. After trying to find the correct wire for the correct terminal ( any help here would be appreciated ,to make sure I have it right ) I no longer have a ign light come on , but I am getting 12v readings from both sides of the coil. Even with all the wires off the ign switch I am getting 12v at the coil which dosn't seem right to me :? .
As you can probably tell I am no authority on wiring so any help would be appreciated.
Also the car has provision for two fuses which were removed. What amp should I use :?: I have used 25amp for now.

Cheers Malcolm from NZ

Mal
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Location: NZ

Post by Mal » Sat Nov 29, 2008 5:07 am

I seem to have the wires sorted out on the ignition switch now and I am getting power through the resister and to the positive terminal of the coil. There is still no spark coming from the coil which is new. On the neg terminal there are three wires, one has a constant power supply to it with the ignition off. Some how this does not seem right to me :?: . Still it doesn't seem to matter if it is connected or not, there is still no spark from the coil.
Any ideas anyone. Thanks MAL

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gvickery
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Tiger Won't Start

Post by gvickery » Tue Dec 02, 2008 12:04 pm

Mal.
Sorry to see your post about the ignition problems you having with your new Tiger. Sadly I cannot add much more to what you have done but hopefully my posting this message will prompt wiser members than I to get onto your case.

Come on STOC let's get some advice to Mal.


Graham
STOC Editor

odl21
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Post by odl21 » Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:46 pm

here's a wiring diagram if you don't have it. hopefully you can work out what's wrong with that and a multimeter or circuit tester.

Image

Mal
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Post by Mal » Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:47 pm

Thanks for the reply Graham. The car has been fitted with a electronic ignition. I was going to get a mobile mechanic out to look at it, but he told me on the phone it sounds likw the ign module. I am getting an open circut which is why I have 12v supply to both terminals of the coil. I have orderd a new one so I will post the result.
Cheers Mal

Mal
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Post by Mal » Wed Dec 03, 2008 7:53 am

Thanks odl21. I am sure that wiring diagram will come in handy. I will see what happens with the new module, hopefully that is the problem.

Thanks MAL

V Mad
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Post by V Mad » Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:36 am

You should be getting about 12 volts at the +ve side of the coil (assuming you don't have a ballast resistor fitted). The -ve side will read 12 volts with the engine off and with electronic ignition.

An easy way to test the basic coil/ignition circuit is to disconnect the -ve terminal to the coil. Then take out your HT lead from the dizzy and put it near a chassis point. Then just touch the coil negative to chassis with a bit of wire a few times and there should be a spark at the coil HT.
Chris :-)
1966 Mk1 260 Tiger
!972 Triumph Stag 3.0V8
www.stagweber.co.uk

Mal
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Post by Mal » Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:34 am

Thanks for the reply Chris. We have it running. The engine has been fitted with a motorcraft elictronic dizzy and a ignition module for a late 70's early eighties BMW, MERC . I don't know if it ever ran with this set up, as we could not get it to even with power going to all the rght places. I have had an auto electrician helping me out, so he pulled the dizzy and module and took them to his workshop. He has now used a Bosch ign module BIM032 which is for a Ford dizzy and is a much simpler set up. Now we have the engine running we can clean up the engine bay of unecessary wiring and I am one step closer to getting the car on the road here in NZ. :mrgreen:

Tomaselli
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Post by Tomaselli » Sat Jan 03, 2009 6:15 pm

Great to hear you managed to get the engine running, must be a relief now that the engine has fired into life 8)

Mal wrote:we can clean up the engine bay of unecessary wiring
Same problem here with a mess of wires, wiring loom that's 40 years old and numerous owners adding/chopping/melting wires, tempted with a new loom :wink:

Keep us posted with progress and will you have the car ready for the anniversary run in Feb being organised by the NZ club :?:

http://www.sunbeamcarclubofnewzealand.org.nz/

Mal
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Post by Mal » Sat Jan 03, 2009 9:14 pm

I will keep you posted on progress. There seems to be a bit of sorting to do on the car, so firstly I will get the engine starting and running properly first. Once started it runs nicely while running but will stop while idleing after a while and is then hard to start. Are you supposed to have a pressure regulator on the fuel line with the electric pump and a Holley carb ?.

The electrician is happy with most of the wiring as it still seems in good condition. He just want's to get rid of the add on's which are many and not so good.

I am afraid I will be back at work when the anniversary run is on, and I dont think I will have the car sorted to a stage I would feel comfortable in doing that sort of mileage . It certainly would be a great run to do as the scenery is spectacular down the south island, and to be able to drive it with a group of other Tigers , Alpine's and other Sunbeams would be special.

Tomaselli
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Post by Tomaselli » Sat Jan 03, 2009 9:26 pm

Mal wrote:but will stop while idleing after a while and is then hard to start
Sounds like the infamous Tiger problem of "vapour lock" I assume it stalls and fails to start again when you are up to full operating temperature. One thing you'll find with the Tiger is that you need to keep cool :D

Mal
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Post by Mal » Sat Jan 03, 2009 10:06 pm

Sounds like the infamous Tiger problem of "vapour lock" I assume it stalls and fails to start again when you are up to full operating temperature. One thing you'll find with the Tiger is that you need to keep cool
It is hard to start from cold as well at the moment. I just went out and tried to start it cold and it would not fire. I seemed to have flooded it, but it had not made any attempt to fire. I will check the float levels and wait for the electrician to wire in the new module fully and see how that helps. I will keep the vapour lock in mind though.
Yesturday when I had it running I drove up the hill and stalled it, so I crash started it, and it started easily.

Cheers Mal.

gtsmrt
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Post by gtsmrt » Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:39 am

Hi Mal,

Is your electrician friend happy with the ignition side of things? From what you have told us, you have sorted through the electrical side of things. Was the car running when you purchased it from the previous owner? It is starting to sound like you may now have issues with the carburettor or fuel pump. If your car has a regulator, check that it is set correctly. That will depend upon your carburettor, but around the 2.5 psi should be fine. While you check the float levels, it may be worth giving the whole carburettor a clean up. I don't think vapour lock will be an issue yet as it sounds like the engine does not run long enough to get hot :wink: .

Good luck,

Regards, Robin.
Robin O'Dell
Tiger MK 1a
ENJOYING THE EXPERIENCE AS DAD WOULD HAVE

Mal
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Post by Mal » Fri Jan 09, 2009 5:19 am

Hi Robin, sorry for the delayed reply, I have been away on holiday.
Is your electrician friend happy with the ignition side of things?.

No not yet, he has just wired up a tempory ign system to get it running,. He wants to wire it through a resistor and ballest wire to get full voltage to the ign while cranking.
I thought the car was running when I bought it, but obviously not. I imported it. The car has no fuel regulator, so I was wondering if it should as it's fuel pump has no return line and it seems to be getting too much fuel.
When it stopped on us it had got to about 190 deg F , once we had it started again it climbed to about 210 deg then started running rough so I switched it off. I think there are a few minor problems to sort out with it so it is good to hear from people with Tigers as the problems and fixes would have been delt with before.

Cheers Mal

Mal
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Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 5:39 am
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Post by Mal » Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:20 am

I thought I would post an up date. The wiring and electrics have all been sorted out now, :D so all I need to do is install a high level stop light to get the car to pass the inspection to register it. In New Zealand, all new registrations have to have a high level stop light no matter how old the car is. Finding an after market one was impossible, so I have orderd one for a 2002 Audi TT convertable, about the only car I have seen an external high level stop light on.
I still do not have the engine running right yet :( . It surges a little while you drive and slowly gets worse until it starts back firing, loses power and running very rough. If you stop it, and leave it for a minute, it will start and run as well as it does, again :? . The temp by the gauge is up to 100 deg C but it is not boiling and if I use an infra red thermometer at the radiator tank it reads 85 deg C. Fuel bowls on the carb read 75 deg C. I am thinking of making up a wooden carb spacer and heat shield to insulate the carb fron engine heat. If that does not work I will have to get a mechanic to sort it out.

Cheers Mal

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